Guys,

I'm suddenly getting a vibration at the front of the car, mostly when accelerating, but otherwise at a very low level most of the time when the car is moving. Not really noticeable at motorway speed, though.

Today I heard the briefest scraping when I turned the car around a tight corner at low speed, but only once, nothing since, and nothing when I manoeuvred into another space later.

I'm thinking a failing/failed inner CV joint - any other suggestions from the house?

I'm about to go check if there's grease anywhere underneath. If so then it's only just happened, as MOT was only a fortnight ago - no warnings about dodgy CV boots though - and this vibration's only been happening this week.

Cheers

S

Isn't a dodgy CV joints a knocking whilst accelerating on full lock, normally when pulling away at a junction. Find a quiet spot somewhere, put the car on full lock, and pull away fairly sharpish. Try both sides. Any clicking/knocking from the front is probably going to be a duff CV joint.

I've found vibration when accelerating in a straight line, especially in 2nd and 3rd, is down to a knackered engine mount, most likely the front one. I know mine is duff and that's the symptoms I get, at least 1.5/1.8 mounts are easily available! You can check this by starting the car, open the bonnet and blip the engine from the throttle body. If the engine rocks backwards, suspect the front engine mount. The rear mount is a pita and means lowering the steering rack and subframe i believe, so do the front and side ones, cured it on my old 1.8 Auto

Jon

Cheers Jon.

There's no clicking or knocking I can discern, but the occasional metal-sounding scrape when turning full left or right.

But a constant background vibration whenever the car is moving - it feels like a rotation-type vibration, and worse on acceleration, particularly up a slope. I thought it starts off as vibration and then gets to clicking when the thing has completely failed?

If it's an engine mount, the engine doesn't need to come out completely, does it? Just jack it up, yes? I'm thinking of labour charges, as it's booked into a local place on Monday. I'm not at home at the moment, and really didn't want to risk damaging anything by driving much further, particularly because if it is a CV joint and it fails, I'm really in trouble.

S

That, that you describe Serena is not a CV joint symptoms.As Dark_Jon said CV's make clicking/knocking noises at cornering.Vibration almoust in any cases occur when an rubber component is torn.It couldn't suppress the vibration and transmit them to the other components.The hint for engine mounts is correct.Look at the front mount(you can see it as it is not covered by anything) inspect it for cracks,torn or any signs of wear.Or simply do the thing that Dark_Jon mentioned
It may be not an engine mount!It could be something else (rubber part again)
Fingers crossed to be something small and not that harmfull..

is there a humming noise while moving? I'm thinking along the lines of wheel bearing

Not that I can discern, Brucey - I've had a wheel bearing die before, and it doesn't sound like that. But I'm not ruling anything out so I'll bear that in mind.

Cheers

S

(None of this is an "April Fool" by the way)

Some queries and opinions that may help diagnosis

Queries
1) Can you feel it through the steering?
2)Does the vibration rate increase with increasing road speed (accelerate) or engine speed (try changing gears) or stay constant?
3) Do you know (or think you know) where it may be coming from (e.g. front left corner)
4) Notice any change in the gear shift mechanism recently?

Opinions
1) Felt through the steering indicates something from the suspension/steering or wheel.
2) Increase with road speed indicates something from the drivetrain (gearbox/driveshaft) to wheel.
Increase with engine speed indicates something with engine/gearbox.
Stays constant indicates something annoyingly difficult to diagnose...and I'm not trying to be funny!
3) Be wary of "I think it's coming from" especially with noises or vibrations. If you feel a 'clunk' when the front left hits a hole or clicking turning a sharp right then that's more certain. Things have a way of resonating in different ways around a car.
4) This can indicate an engine/drivetrain to chassis misaligment, like a dead engine mount.

Some checks. First two are both easy and urgent/serious.
A) Check a wheel is not coming loose (you'd be surprised).
B) Check a tyre hasn't developed a bulge/weakness in either the tread or the sidewall including the inner sidewall. A bulged inner sidewall could be the scraping on e.g. the strut.
C) Check the balancing weights haven't come off the wheel.
D) Check the wheels are mounted properly- centred properly. IF they are not then they could have shifted causing wobble and possible bending the studs or even crack an alloy. If it does, the wheel nuts will be loose... leading to A. One issue is not having the correct centrebore size, then all the pressure (especially shear/transverse) is on the studs and they're not really designed to handle that.
E) Level surface, handbrake on, first gear engaged, diagonally opposite wheel chocked and jack up the wheel with the wheelnuts tight. Pull/push on (try to wobble) the top and bottom of the wheel. If you have movement/looseness/wobble, you likely have a suspension arm/mount problem (I think). Pull/push on (try to wobble) the left and right of the wheel. If you have looseness you likely have a steering issue (tie rod end/pitman arm/steering joint/etc I think).

Hope this helps,

Patrick

The scrape could well be nothing to do with the problem you've brought up but the brake disc guard a bit bent touching the disc which is made worse when on full lock, either that or a stone lodged in the gap but then you'd hear it all the time

The knocking/clicking sound on full lock is a hint for the outer cv joint. The inner cv joint does not move on steering angle. Vibration could definitely be inner joint but you might wanna rule out a crooked rim and unbalance in the wheel first. After that my first guess would be the inner cv joint or a bent axle but that is rather unlikely.

Arne

Thank you all very much

maZZda - yep, could be an engine mount, the front one of mine doesn't look in brilliant condition (although I don't have experience to judge if one is dead).

Steve, you're quite right - in fact the brake pads were changed a couple of weeks ago and I was fiddling with the brake disc guard. I will check it.

Patrick - wheel nuts were the first thing I checked; twice in fact. They're all fine. I'll do the wheel checks you suggest when I get the car back.

* For a while it's had what I thought was a grumbling clutch bearing: intermittent noises in first and reverse, the occasional gear crunch. Accelerating off traffic lights, I have to change into 1st very carefully/slowly to prevent jumping/shaking. But until now there was no ongoing vibration: as of this week there's additional low level vibration all the time. No strange noises, just vibration.
* The vibration increases under sudden acceleration, and uphill. But once I'm up to speed it subsides to a low level again.
* It's not specifically noticeable through the steering: I can't feel the steering vibrate in my hands. It's a feeling in the whole vibration of the engine when the car is in motion.

Sneakz/Arne Thank you. No, there's no noise, clicking or other trouble on full lock in either direction, apart from the one brief scraping sound when I turned in a car park yesterday. So probably not outer CV joint, then.

S

When they changed your pads, does they fit new discs or they dismantlle the old discs and refit them again?If so the hub flange could be rusted a litlle bit and if not cleaned(steel brush) could cause the discs to touch the pads.That could be felt like vibration.Jacking up one wheel and turning it on hand could show you if this "touching"is present.But that should be felt trought the steering wheel.Check it.

I will do, thanks.

The pad change was done by R0b from the club - nothing was done to the discs, it was just a quick pad change. The calipers badly need a refurbishment, though, I'm going to do that as soon as I find a kit.

S

UPDATE: the garage say they're "95% certain" it's a driveshaft ... they haven't been any more explicit yet (so whether shaft itself or CV joint, I don't know), but they're sourcing parts and I'll know more tomorrow.

S

Isn't there an inner bearing on one of the driveshafts? think I looked in to it with my old GLX Auto. 1 drive shaft is 1 piece and the other is split in to two if I remember correctly...

Here you go:
http://mazdaepc.com/parts/323F/AEBM02/W1/2510/

Item 25-700 (top middle), is enlarged in the top right. You'll see the right hand drive shaft (left on the page) comes out of the gearbox to a support/bearing (25-700) then a 2nd shaft goes to the CV joint. Might be that which has gone?

Jon

Yes, I was looking at this, yesterday

They just called, and yes, the problem seems to be with the driver's side driveshaft.

We've had to take a gamble that that is the issue, though: they're pretty sure, but not 100% sure, but they can't find out unless they swap in a new one. So if it doesn't solve the problem then I still get stung for a couple of hours labour fitting/removing. But actually that's fair enough, they've been running the car around since Saturday trying to trace the fault, and at least I'll be safe in the knowledge that my driveshafts/CV joints are fine!!

If it is the driveshaft, thank god I decided to take it in rather than risk the trip back to Surrey...

They're going to let me know in an hour or so what the deal is.

S

Be interesting to hear exactly what the problem with the drive shaft is SJ. I haven't heard of many problems with drive shafts apart from them bending/snapping/twisting etc

I'll report back later. Although it could simply be that it's a 20 year old part, which is at the latter end of its life-expectancy, and has randomly died.

S

Final news today is that having taken the gamble to have the existing driveshaft removed and examined, it is fine ... the problem lies with the gearbox differential, so I need to find a gearbox specialist.

Anyone know a reliable gearbox magician out my way? (Surrey)

Apparently it is safe to drive, so I'll fetch it back here tomorrow and go from there

S

I was 1000% sure there was no problems with the driveshaft..
Get the car back home, driving try to determine does the vibration comes from left or right side of the front.Stop and switch the front tyres.Left one on the right of the car,and the right on the left side of the car.Drive again.If the vibration changes/moves to other side or just changes it's rhythm.Suspect wheel bend due to potholes.Or tyre failure(torn fibers or something)
That should be felt bigger with further acceleration.
The other thing that i got in mind is the "hanging bearing for the longer driveshaft(here is right one,to you it has to be the left) So the left driveshaft has additional bearing that is fixed with nuts on the back of the engine block.It could be it.I'm just guessing, i don't actually know the symptoms of gone driveshaft bearing..
Other than that -> I'm out of ideas..

I was 1000% sure there was no problems with the driveshaft..
Get the car back home, driving try to determine does the vibration comes from left or right side of the front.Stop and switch the front tyres.Left one on the right of the car,and the right on the left side of the car.Drive again.If the vibration changes/moves to other side or just changes it's rhythm.Suspect wheel bend due to potholes.Or tyre failure(torn fibers or something)
That should be felt bigger with further acceleration.
The other thing that i got in mind is the "hanging bearing for the longer driveshaft(here is right one,to you it has to be the left) So the left driveshaft has additional bearing that is fixed with nuts on the back of the engine block.It could be it.I'm just guessing, i don't actually know the symptoms of gone driveshaft bearing..
Other than that -> I'm out of ideas..

are the gearboxes same 1.5 and zxi? If so I have a spare one, I swapped my zxi one with a lsd lantis box when I installed my ze. So there's full working gearbox if its the same fit

I've also got the auto box still in my xedos if you need the auto one

The inner driveshaft has 3 bearings, if 0ne is faulty, could cause this.

Cheers Brucey!

I'm not sure what my options are yet. If I get it checked out, it can't be repaired and I'm quoted a fortune for a new/refurbed one (£500 min for a refurbed box, by the looks of it), then a trip to get yours is a serious possibility - I know you're in Durham but I'm not fussed about that.

First step, there's a place near me that offers a no-obligation assessment. I'll see what they say and go from there.

S

I have driveshafs and Gearbox if you need.

well Nottingham would be closest option but mine is available if need be, its surplus to requirements and just taking up space so I'll set my price tag a free to good home in this case.

Hero!!

Arnie - thank you!

I'll keep you both in the loop ...

S

The saga continues - put the kettle on

As the local clutch/gearbox shop nearest me in north Surrey refused to touch the car "because it's a Mazda and we don't have the expertise" [FFS!!! ] I risked driving it up to a place in Reading I've used before, also a clutch/gearbox shop who should be able to quickly recognise a bosted clutch/gearbox when they encounter one.

However, after examining the car yesterday after a detailed chat with me about the symptoms, and obtaining a copy of the workshop sheet from the London garage I took the car to first (and presumably doing their own road test), they are now convinced that the first garage was spot on with their original assessment, and that the issue DOES lie with the driver's side driveshaft.

So, whereas the first garage couldn't find a problem with the original DS after they took it out, and opted to refit it, this second place is actually going to replace it. However, the part they received today, they discovered, is only the outer half (it's a 2-part shaft): they were expecting both halves, but apparently the inner half can only be ordered from Mazda ..............

So tomorrow they're going to fit the outer half and hope that resolves the issue. And if it doesn't? I guess a small mortgage will be in order when Mazda demand a fortune for the inner half.

And then we hope that that was completely the source of the problem, and I'm not then facing a bill to take off the gearbox as well.

I received an inheritance today, although I wasn't planning to spend most of it on Sundance!

I wish to god I'd had access to a ramp (the reason I had to use a third party: I have no ramp and nowhere to work), as I'd have tackled the damn thing myself with help from the Club for parts. Belatedly I've discovered from my MG-driving neighbour that there is a ramp-hire place in nearby Farnborough, so as soon as this issue is resolved I'll be checking that out.

Hopefully I will still make Silverstone on Sunday, but right now this saga is looking longer than Lord of the Rings!

S

The Driver's side outer shaft has 3 roller bearings which fit into the inner Shaft that is bolted to the engine.
AS I mentioned before if these bearing are gone they can be replaced. No need to replace the entire shaft. Any good bearing shop can source these. Once the shaft is removed it should be east to tell if these bearings are worn.
There is not much to go wrong with the inner shaft.

Brilliant, thanks Arnie. Yes, I'm hoping they'll use common sense when they take out the old one, and not replace it if it isn't necessary. The first garage couldn't find anything wrong with it, so I'm interested to see what this place says tomorrow. I'll ask them about the bearings when they call.

If they do replace the whole thing, I'm going to ask them to keep the part so I can have a look.

S